Elves in Pannithor

The Definitive Kings of War Guide

Well my guide anyway!

So another year, another COK (20) and another season for me pushing arrogant elves.

I mean shit changed right, last year I primarily played variants of the list below at locals but for the most part I played TR.  I promised this review to a lot of people and will enjoy writing ad thinking about it, im capricious and slightly antagonistic though so please take it with the tongue and cheek intended

Palace Guard regiment

Palace Guard regiment

Storm wind regiment who find paths

Storm wind regiment who take creatine

Glade stalker troop

Archer troop

Blizzard Wizard on an inspiring  pony

Alchemist curse wizard on foot with critters call

King on pony with beast slayer heading up his formation

ASB with a banjo

Madriga

regiment of drakon war hawk things

Basically I had moved to a less traditional elf list, for me a combination of critters call, weakness and lack of black crown meant I didn't rate archer and drakon hordes as much as many became reliant. Im 22-1-0 with this style of list by the way and have played several masters players with it.

So if you are expecting a self loathing whinge fest, go listen to counter charge, have the RC got shit very wrong with elves, yes on some of it, did the guys have some great points on counter charge, yes some, but it wasn't constructive tbh. I think as a commentator on anything its important to provide solution and not just whinge. 

This is going to be a marathon of a review. Half way through i'll cut the blog and do sylvan and twilight another day, I suggest breaking at the unit review end also and coming back before you read the tactics and list reviews.

Right now ill put in my disclaimers, I am opinionated, I do see some things black and white and I cant change that or be positive about something I'm not, I do value opinions, so hit me up.

twitter@chaffmaster1, messenger ap, facebook or on this blog in comments

Units review

Scores out of ten are trp/reg/hrde

Sabre tooth hunting cat special army upgrade available on king to give +5 attacks against individuals 10 points, or prince extra 3 attacks.

My verdict is you have 10 points left or a king you might take this

Kindred Tallspears

Same as before I always liked these and I still do, phalanx is a more impactful rule than it once was, id get a troop of these over battle cats for 90, 140 for a regiment is frustrating for people to deal with and I think at 230 the horde is a tad pricey, but with bane chant they rock. I have to be honest I try and avoiding putting items on them, but if I was gonna I think crystal pendant or measured force are their gigs and pathfinder to push them up and leave hindered charges can be a thing.

5/7/7

Palace Guard

Same as before, I rarely left home without some, elves don't have much CS and these always gave some grind, however now they come in hordes.

Here is the thing I think the horde is a trap, def 4 hordes at nearly 300 with an item, with no defensive tech seems really sad. I can see these getting, chaffed out, shot up etc etc, but if multiples are taken I think they could be great.

the regiments still grind nicely and I will still take them to be my work horses, the troops are still really hitty and great chaff that hurts.

6/8/7

Shield watch

This new unit is essentially palace guard that trade up a point of defence for melee and nerve decreases. They are decent enough and I think they could be seen but not that often. They are the hardest to remove troop elves have so that's something, the regiment is quite grindy, but melee 4 is sad with elite its far worse than the normal 16% drop in effectiveness and not worth bane chanting.

5/5

Forest Guard

This new unit are in effect palace guard literally taking out the CS1 and adding pathfinder and TC1, I think these will be taken eventually when people work out they are decent and often palace guard in offence that are a point harder to hit if charged or shot because they will be in terrain. One or two of these in regiment seems strong, and is some money for me in troops, could flatter to deceive but early testing they look ok.

5/6

Hunters of wild (irregular)

Big changes to these guys, rebasing :( def 5 pathfinder scout, accurate melee infantry, are interesting, but the fact they are irregular means you will likely only see troop and if you do why when it could be forest guard, scout does up the score but I feel they may be to slow to abuse it with what elves do to support.  Not awful but no cs or tc or elite is a big deal and id probably use them if they were fearless.

4/3

Kindred archers

So these are the same as before except they lost elite in melee and umm well they may have gone down to hitting on 5s.

OK with this unit the RC have lost the plot. No one really ever took horde 5+ shooting with no piercing. Guess what that wont change for the most part, that said they are ok into matches with light chaff or if you are desperate for unlocks I guess.  Basically shooting got hit in about 8 places but these were good before because for 30 points they became 16% more effective and that went up again with a bane chant, but with the buffs not existing the big unit is basically a huge target.

I think regiments as a cheap unlock will be seen and are cheap enough to forget, the troops I can see very rarely taken as cheap objective baby sitters, the hordes are probably 40 ish points overcosted (if you don't believe me assume elite and phalanx both have no value and look in order of the brothermark.

4/6/2

Therennian sea guard

Ok not my bag, hurt massively by the same indirect things as hit the archers but losing elite on arrows was a minor direct nerf to them in comparison.  So these are better archers than archers in every situation but are worse spearmen.  Traditionally the horde was taken with nimble and you may still see this but vicious is also good, you may see them because of unlock issues but I just think being more than palace guard is actually comic and so for this reason i'm not expecting to see many.

The regiments are interesting in msu/mmu builds at 165 and sitting on an objective in terrain are useful for piece trading while offering a threat with the bow. You may see some but I genuinely think are still a little price especially as a horde

-/6/4

Glade stalkers

This irregular choice are the new archers and a bit of a poster child, steady aim, pathfinder, full elite and scout, me4+ means they are a genuine all rounder. However expensive and super fragile def 3, I think they pay for scout and with steady aim now in it has a limited benefit.  You can buy regiments but I don't get it as irregular and essential the only benefit being nerve and corckscrew charges, so I expect them to be every ones favourite troop.

7/3

Stormwind cavalry

Decent cavalry have always only needed a point of nerve to complete them as a regiment, great unlocking unit. Drakons are irregular and formation is gone and phalanx could be a thing, so  I think a lot of lists will have 1 unit of them. The troops are expensive but are surprisingly good chaff pinch hitters.

5/8

Silver breeze

Another irregular poster child, dropped points and gained me4 (no elite)means people see these as a spam solution and I really don't, range 18 bows is a huge drop in effectiveness however as a replacement for seaguard unless you need the unlocks these are another decent allrounder. 

I think people may start with regiments but I think they are more versatile as troops and in addition will collectively be more resilient, and I think too many is a bad thing

7/7

Battle cats

Cheap rubbish swarm, I don't like them I don't see what they do, if I want a cheap objective holder archers are better.

If I wanted something to chock stuff up i'm likely to use forest guard.

They are useable because of nimble but I don't think they will make make many lists as points in elves is tight and lack of path finder is massive for what they want to do.

3

Forest shamblers

I want to make these work but irregular in elves and needing a surge guy to even be moderately effective means my models will still collect dust.  I guess the regiments are still good blocking pieces to trade up, that's about my only compliment. Hordes I cant make work at all and I don't think anyone else has either 4/3

War chariots

need rebasing and the size of base making them hard to play, are irregular, dropped ranged in number of shots and in to hit number and in range, also phalanx more prevailant.  Probably one of  the worst units in the game, the troop has a tiny interest

3/1/1/1

Drakon riders

Deserved nerf in losing nimble but hit less than most similar units, now irregular, could still be about as still hit like trucks, but a lot of points

6/5

Bolt thrower

stock has risen due to the stock in archers dropping and other war machines being prevailant but I don't see them as better than before and gladestalkers feel a lot better. Fits a filler niche but lacks the potential of unit strength.

5

Dragon breathe

breath weapons are nerfed, this one is nerfed more and can virtually always be charged after shooting. Its not good tbh

2

Tree herder

this much maligned fella now has 9 attatcks, strider and radiance of life on top of his befores, its massive he stays as a 50mm and its a definite consideration

7

Elven king

a really competent but very expensive individual, I wish he could have a bow so much, but he cant so will usually be on a horse.

7

Lord on Drakon

always been a little underwhelmed by this guy I think he is 1-2 attacks or 1-2 nerve short, but in an edition of potentially slightly smaller units and less nimble flyers he may have a little more use

6

Elven prince

less breathe weapons smaller units, increased number of war machines, 80 on a horse, he looks very tempting maybe 2

8

ASB

still good but maybe seen less, the need for inspiring is less now tree man are better and kings and better. Will still see him playing a banjo but less id think

5

Elven mage

lightning bolt, elite, boomstick. 1+ Until next cok when they will be nerfed

9

Dragon Kindred Lord

Still a great choice looks even better now drakons have been hit with nimble nerf.  Will still see them as great premium unlock choice, obviously the phalanx change could hit them massively, but much less than drakons because of nimble.

6

Noble war chariots

its a chariot, its a character slot and it got nerfed

1

Madriga the elf

lost vicious but gained inspiring self and a point of speed and 15 points. My favourite girl maybe a little expensive now especially considering the mage with LB

4

Tydarion

A dragon with CS4, very inspiring, brutal for 30 points, seems reasonable tbh

6

Argus Rodinar

Interesting choice I mean another reason not to chose an ASB, if this guy had unit strength he would be auto include, however only contributing by granting inspiring while taking an unlock is a little niche. I think he will be seen, but I expect to see more king, princes, dragons, mages in the character slots

5

Lists and tactics.

I suspect when the edition first begins you will see a lot of people trying high movement elf lists mainly unlocked by regiments of archers and possibly the odd stormwind cavalry.   Something like 3 dragons, 3 reg archers, 3 regiments of silverbreeze and extras.  I think its a solid enough bas but I think opposition flyers are an issue, I think its vulnerable to shooting and I worry about the lack of high quality attacks that could possibly even be healed off. However ive seen a lot of this type of design which seems popular with people. 

The alternative build will likely be 3 palace guard hordes, with king a couple of mages and troops of glade stalkers, with maybe a unit of drakons to taste.  I think this build is an attempt at a brute force build but I feel it can be out played fairly easily if the opponents moves or shoots well.

We have to go away from the idea of elves being a brute force maths faction and frankly play better using movement strengths.  The archer horde is dead but I believe we have a decent phalanx horde that in game that could be used to unlock if not PG are also decent, alternatively I think we will be basing our lists on an MMU or MSU (multiple small/medium units) that will give us combined strength. 

Elves still alpha strike (with ranged)  in a way that most others cant but it doesn't win the game in a turn any more as its not stacking numbers its a death by a thousand cuts model. I think people will need to segment the board and trade up continually by dinging units up with some shots then trading a cheap combat unit to finish off. 

Many of you will know that is the style of list I played for a long time in 2nd edition and it is effective I promise you, with the added bonus it looks great on the table and is fun to play and makes your worst possible match ups still playable as its not polarising.  The design of list im looking at right now to take into account how I feel the first year meta will be at 2K is

Elven King on horse, shard blade and sabre cat

Lord on Drakon

Archmage LB Boomstick

Archmage  LB BC Conjurers staff

Regiment Stormwind Cav Jess' Boots

Regiment Stormwind Cav Maccwars Caterpillar

Regiment Palace Guard

Regiment Palace Guard

Regiment of Kindred archers

Troop of glade stalkers

Troop of glade stalkers

Troop of Silver breeze

Troop of Silver breeze

I'm sure over coming weeks this will change about, but for scenario and positive point scoring systems this seems really good. On systems with VP difference the silver breeze would likely become 1, the second mage will become a healer and id drop the regiment of archers to become a regiment of drakon riders.

Things I think I would face

Night stalkers, goblins, basileans and undead would likely be seen a lot this coming year potentially add abyssal dwarves to that,  it hurts me to say but I think elves have limited ways of dealing with the war machines we could see, 6 war machines will be common and it annoys me indirect ignores people playing well,  other than that I don't think this edition is too scary for elves.  I don't think the number of phalanx units will be around that people say will, I don't believe overall will be as many flying circuses and I think healing will be very expensive for most factions, I think a down tick in bow fire will also massively benefit this list. 

I could be wrong I mean my list was shit for masters apparently, I played trident realms out of the formations all year,  and won an event with undead using a list without using surge, but we will see what happens, for now stay safe and have a happy Christmas, ill try to get either sylvan and twilight or trident realm done soon, depending to be honest on the feedback from this one. 

Please post on any FB group, twitter, or this blog any comment, critique or question you have, I don't claim to be the all seeing knowledge by the way is probably a million ways of playing this game.